Says it all....

[msjaybee.livejournal.com]

You know, I think the hatred of Gwen spreads far, far wider than this comm.  Here's a little statistic to prove it.  On Fanfiction.net there are 7,669 Torchwood stories.    476 are about Gwen.   In contrast, 3,777 are about Ianto. 

How about when Gwen is teamed with Jack?  How popular is the idea of Gwack?  There are a grand total of 264 stories where Gwen is shipped with Jack.  Not a lot, you will agree.  Now, how about Janto?  3,179 stories. 

Remind me again why Gwen is the star of Miracle Day with Jack returning due to his undying love for her?  It seems to me that only RTD, TPTB at Starz and a very few others think that Super Cooper being worshipped by a lovestruck Jack are a good idea. 

I certainly don't.

Comments

[charie-caphine.livejournal.com]

Actually, without filters 'Torchwood' has currently got 9,388 stories there, of which:
116 list John Hart,
272 list Tosh,
446 list Owen,
579 list Gwen as a character,
4,802 list Ianto,
5,214 list Jack.
Just numbers, out of very idle curiosity.
Seems very much what could be expected, actually. Wonder if and how it'll change post-MD.

[mscatmoon.livejournal.com]

The last time I checked, which was about a year ago, search engines like Google were much the same. Ianto (don't even need the last name) yields far far more entries and pages than Gwen. Cooper or Williams, and one must subtract all the results that are about a different Gwen Cooper. Even with those Ianto beats her hands down. Of all the polls I've seen everywhere/anywhere on the net (including on Torchwood websites), Ianto always places first or second on fav character while Gwen is very often last. Make no mistake, the only people who love Gwen are RTD and his minions and a small number of fans. The idea that she's so popular is totally delusional although I'm sure she's gotten a *little* more popular now that RTD killed off everyone else and made Jack unlikeable for a lot of us! Of course that won't last long since there will soon be new American characters for fans to love (although he may very well kill them all off too by the end of MD). As for the new show, it remains to be seen if new viewers are taken by new Americanized Gwen's wonderfullness or not.

[dr-doomsduck.livejournal.com]

I googled Gwen a couple of times and more often than not, the first two or three results are about torchwood's, the others are about a writer who has the same name. However, I don't think torchwood will have that particular cult status anymore, meaning that, like those law and order shows and sit-coms, they'll have to work with a casual fanbase...therefore, very few fansites, fanfics etc. I wonder how much longer Torchwood will fit in on a comicon or a sci-fi convention, as it will be a "political drama".

[larebilinyc.livejournal.com]

But "Eve Myles" as a single search term yields far more results than "Gareth David Lloyd". Fanfiction is a trivial concept. 20,000 fan fiction could writers could stop paying attention to Torchwood and nobody on the production team would bat an eyelid.

[larebilinyc.livejournal.com]

Meant to say it's the same for any show, not just Torchwood. Jack/Doctor is probably the second most written Doctor Who pairing, but that doesn't effect Doctor Who in any way.

[ella-caramella.livejournal.com]

Are you sure? I just googled both of them and Eve Myles pops up at the 3rd place only when you add her surname while GDL's name appears 1st place when you're still writing his middle name.

Plus:

EM brings up 397,000 results
GDL brings up 533,000 results

This according to Google.

[ella-caramella.livejournal.com]

It also has to be considered that, while "Eve Myles" can only be spelt in an univocal way, "Gareth David-Lloyd" is often spelt with AND without the hyphen, so a google search will return two different sets of results, that should be combined to give the definite number.

[dvcorvis.livejournal.com]

google just now yeild

EM 249,000
GDL 515,000 (with hyphen)
GDL 518,000 (w/o hyphen) but in fareness it also returned many of the same results ...so strickly adding hyphen + no Hyphen directly isnt accurate

But truth be known is 518K is more than 249K

[ella-caramella.livejournal.com]

Google "Gwen Cooper Torchwood" and you'll get 389,000 results, google "Ianto Jones Torchwood" and you'll get 798,000.

Also, about the google search for "Eve Myles", there are more interviews and articles there right now, obviously, since she's currently filming and promoting Torchwood, while her ex co-worker(s) are not. Not a sign of popularity, that, just a further sign of EM being pushed up front to the media along with being pushed down the viewers' throat.

[dr-doomsduck.livejournal.com]

nah, that's not completely fair, if GDL got a major role for a series, he'd be getting more publicity as well. I'm still hoping that Burn Gorman, Naoko Mori or him get a big role somewhere, so far, it's not happening though. Likewise, if EM wasn't part of Torchwood, she'd have next to no publicity too.

Now if we'd look at how much publicity Mekhi phifer and Bill Pullman are getting, thát is rather sad. So far, I've been hearing ten times more from EM than from these two. Yeah, in that way, she gets more publicity.

Ofcourse, don't even get me started on the shameless and most likely completely misleading use of John Barrowman's publicity as a main player.

[ella-caramella.livejournal.com]

That's exactly what I meant. If GDL was still part of the show and was currently filming, like EM is, there would be interviews with him and articles promoting the new series mentioning him.

But since he's not there, the recurring name in the articles is that of EM, hence the larger amount of Google results in the current searches.

She gets more publicity, she does, and it's sad that she keeps getting pushed up front while more deserving actors like Bill Pullman are not. I was surprised that Pullman was with Barrowman in Cannes, actually, I wonder how come they didn't send "The Star" of the show to do the promotion? Guess she was too busy on the set.

[dr-doomsduck.livejournal.com]

ah, sorry, I misunderstood then :)

Still, somehow I doubt if GDL would've gotten any attention if he were still a part of the show. Likewise, we hear nothing from the pathologist, the PR-lady and Esther, aside from the fact that they'll be joining Torchwood. The only media attention (aside from conventions and such) GDL got was after Ianto was killed, because it caused so much controversy.

Funny thing, if we add that fact to the amount of google searches, we can conclude that apparently the internet community has a great deal of attention for GDL while the 'official media' has more eye for EM. Call me a wikileaksfan but I steadfastly believe that the official media is sometimes more propaganda then some of the things on the internet (not all, DEFINITELY NOT AlL).

:o that's not a very promising thought, EM on set instead of JB and Pullman. Me thinks those two are more there to lure people in than they are there for the story...

[ella-caramella.livejournal.com]

Still, somehow I doubt if GDL would've gotten any attention if he were still a part of the show. [...] The only media attention (aside from conventions and such) GDL got was after Ianto was killed, because it caused so much controversy.

I agree only in part: I too doubt that he would have much media attention *now* given that they are currently pushing EM above anyone else.

But before CoE, if you remember, there was a lot of media coverage about both JB and GDL, when they were pushing the misleading notion that the Jack/Ianto (nonexistant) love story was important and "crucial to the story line" and blah blah blah. Those articles and interviews happened before CoE, I mean, not after Ianto got killed.

But way before CoE, GDL was getting the attention of the media. Now the spotlight is, of course, only for EM.

[slns7552.livejournal.com]

"somehow I doubt if GDL would've gotten any attention if he were still a part of the show"

When they were doing publicity and talk show interviews didn't Eve Myles keep jumping in and hardly let GDL, and at another time Nyoko, get a word in. If I remember that one talk show EM consistently interrupted and jumped in ahead of GDL to answer the questions.

[mscatmoon.livejournal.com]

Yeah, and the person who said TPTB don't care about fans is probably right. If Mekhi and the other MD characters become fan favs and start having tons of fic written about them and Gwen is still mostly ignored, they'd *still* insist she was the star and beloved by all. I'm sure there will be a lot of fic about Jack and whatever-male-he-snogs in the show since fans love slashing him with various... but to RTD&co Gwen will still be his true love. They've never cared about reality or fan opinion before, I guess it's not likely they'll start.

In a way, I'm actually hoping RTD goes and kills off *everyone* in day ten, including Jack, leaving only Gwen standing (with her Big Gun most likely, maybe the baby will be in the other arm). Then those who think RTD is god might finally understand that he doesn't care about any of his fans. Except the Gwen lovers (all 5 of them). Hmm... just realized that her kid had to be a girl. So the legacy of Gwen The Awesome can go on forever. A million years in the future Jack will be in love with another Gwen who is Hero of the Universe. It's her destiny don'cha know. Unless RTD decides to make Gwen immortal too. Formally that is, we all know she already is. (Meanwhile, in heaven, Ianto Tosh and Owen are going, "Thank god I'm dead!").

[slns7552.livejournal.com]

I think her name is Anwen, not Branwen.

[dr-doomsduck.livejournal.com]

jep, sorry, confused the name with a character from a book I'm reading...:S. Look, that's how invested I am in the new Torchwood.

anyone know how I can edit me post? or is it just a matter of deleting and reposting

[slns7552.livejournal.com]

No problem. Just thought I'd mention it.

I never have figured out how to edit. I usualy copy what I've posted, delete, and then post again.

[dr-doomsduck.livejournal.com]

There, now it's totally in the wrong order, but at least the name is right. :) thanks for the help.

[dr-doomsduck.livejournal.com]

RTD does not care about his fans or his series. The ease with which he insults people and the amount of episodes he ACTUALLY wrote assure me of that. Starz however, does care about the ratings, causing the show to have stars like pullman and Phifer, to up it, not to mention the gunporn and the gayporn. Me thinks it'll turn into your typical spartacuslike show. Crude with lots of violence and mindless sex. (no offence if you like spartacus, it has its merits, but these are just things the make me tune out)

OH god, that future you painted made me puke in my mouth for a bit....the kid, Anwen, I have high hopes she'll turn into a typical...anti-villian? You know, kid who lived in her mothers shadow, starts to revolt against it in puberty (piercings, there will be lots of piercings). Major mommy-issues because Gwen never wanted her. Growing up with Jack around prevents her from falling in love with him. She'll find a way to get power (difficult childhood makes fictional characters exceptionally strong) and then go Apeshit on earth and her mother, starting the first human empire, which, eventually will give humans a worthy place in the universe. Oh, yes, Anwen, empress of humanity. MUHAHAHA

*you can bring in the men in white coats now*

Meanwhile I believe that Ianto will reincarnate and find his way to Jack. Maybe even help Anwen with the finer points of a peaceful world domination.

[larebilinyc.livejournal.com]

Go to advanced search and use exact term. That way you're not searching for Gareth David and his friend Lloyd or three seperate terms!

Once you do that:

1,100,000 for Eve Myles
648,000 for Gareth David Lloyd

http://www.google.co.uk/advanced_search?q=%22eve+myles%22&hl=en&lr=&prmd=ivnso

Also reveals only a 50,000 difference between Gwen Cooper and Ianto Jones, which can probably be purely attributed to slash on ff sites and lj and slash recs. Lol.

(Jones is the most common english language surname and although Ianto is less common it would still flag up every time someone called Ianto _____ was mentioned next to _____ Jones)

**Google nerd**

[dr-doomsduck.livejournal.com]

Google nerding right backatcha, when I start looking at the results in the exact search term. The Eve Myles results also have a portrait artist among them and after about 10 pages or so, 90% of the results are something about lesbian porn. When I look at those of Gareth David Lloyd (a more uncommon name then Eve Myles) after 24 pages, the results are still about the actor.

Not that that really matters because both play in different movies and one even plays in a band.

Looking at the character names, I'd say the Gwen Cooper is a more common name, as it can be British, Welsh, American, Australian and whatnot. While the name Ianto would nearly only exist in Wales. Add the Jones suffix to it, and you'd elimate 99% of the parents from abroad who liked that name for their baby.

[ella-caramella.livejournal.com]

From Google:

"Punctuation that is not ignored

The hyphen - is sometimes used as a signal that the two words around it are very strongly connected. (Unless there is no space after the - and a space before it, in which case it is a negative sign.)"

Which means that people still spell GDL *and* GD-L in their web sites, articles, fanfic and such. And Google claims there's indeed a difference in how you spell things when you do a search.

I also believe there's more than one (famous) Eve Myles on this planet? Like this one, for example?

http://www.evemyles.com/

[larebilinyc.livejournal.com]

Ok I don't know now. I didn't mean to start a war. EM's actress specific wiki page gets more views than GDL's - know that's not representtative but shows her getting more "hits" in a non- fandom environment. But I'll back out and run away!

[ella-caramella.livejournal.com]

No war and no need to run away. Stay here! ;P

Why do you think that Wiki is a non fandom environment, though? And does that mean that if I check EM on Wiki then I like her more than I like GDL?

I don't think so. But I am, you know, just curious now.

[kaitelynn.livejournal.com]

well I for one, am not sure that I am even going to watch the new series, unless it shows up on BBCamerica or something. With money being tight, I am not going to pay good money for Starz to be stuck with the gwen love in. and from everything that I am seeing, the new series is going to be the same as anything I could see on fox or USA, just with more cursing or something. That's not why I started watching Torchwood. I started watching it because it was something different from everything else out there but I guess RTD needed the money or something and was content with ruining a good show. They aren't aiming this show towards those that made TW popular in the first placxe, they are going for the basic American office, which no matter what they say, will probably mean seeing Jack fawning over Gwen and mainly other women because(unfortunately) that is what the group the are going for (males between 18 and 40) want to see. While it might be okay for Jack to talk about being with guys, they just don't want to see it(hell that's the way it was on Will and Grace). If we wanted to see Jack/any guy action the show would have to be on Showtime *G*

Okay, rant over. Just needed to get that out for now. *G*

[mscatmoon.livejournal.com]

You know, the more I think about it the more I believe that *is* the reason for RTD's actions. He wanted Gwenwood, it was supposed to be her show and her the star, and those annoying fans kept liking the wrong characters. So he had to kill them all off and make Jack her one true love. Oh, and turn her into a superhero with a bazooka. Of course Gwen is going to get more internet hits now that she and Jack are the only main characters left and they're starting to pub the new series.

[dr-doomsduck.livejournal.com]

I made the mistake of going to wikipedia for some quick and easy info, that was...enlightening. Makes Gwen sounds like the best thing since sliced bread and me feel like a crazy conspiracy theorist amongst the how-can-you-not-like-her group of people.

I am really, really wondering if she's that popular, or if there is something wrong with the system of awarding and rating? It mentioned one random poll in a torchwood magazine where she came out as the second most popular? Ofcourse, if a movie like Avatar can get so much attention and good criticism (It's Pocahontas, IN BLUE!!) then sure, maybe society is going nuts. In the words of Albert Einstein:

A question that sometimes drives me hazy: am I or are the others crazy?

[mscatmoon.livejournal.com]

It's a total lie! Long before anyone heard anything about MD, some fans had done research that very clearly showed Gwen was not very popular. TW mag? There has been plenty of evidence to support that they were biased on RTD's side and very capable of lying to promote the party line. People who wrote letters to the mag that disagreed with TPTB were not printed, or edited, and only pro-Gwen pro-COE pro-American TW were allowed. Internet polls have regularly been rigged as well (and yet Gwen/new TW still couldn't win them! Those of us on SIJ are very familiar with that kind of thing.
In the words of don't-know-who-said-it:

Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you.

[dr-doomsduck.livejournal.com]

See, that's the idea I keep getting, but then there's the damn whitewashing. Oh forget it, people think I'm nuts for watching the show anyway, what more damage can my image sustain anyway.

Your quote from don't-know-who reminded me of this picture :P

http://pichars.org/x45js

[mscatmoon.livejournal.com]

LOL! Great caption, and fits this situation so perfectly. Me, I've always been a "black sheep" anyway.

[slns7552.livejournal.com]

I agree. None of my letters made it into TW mag, only the pro-Gwen. The interviews with some of the guests were also biased toward Eve Myles and John Barrowman. The guests were asked how they liked working with them or the guest would only talk about working with them. Hardly anything about anyone else who was on the show.

[irishjantogirl.livejournal.com]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. If repeatedly claiming that something like "Jack's unstatd love for Gwen" *pauses as IJG vomints* maked it true; then I'm going to someday marry Gareth David-Lloyd. Hey if I said it; then it's true. Or does that only aply to 'professional' writers and not to a 'hysterical' teenage girl with a laptop?

[sagrario martínez castro (from livejournal.com)]

JB 3.400.000 results.
GDL 2.890.000 results.
EM 1.870.000 results.