Second chances?

[ceindreadh.livejournal.com]

Okay, I know I could get run out of the community for bringing this up here ;-)
but I'm feeling pretty mellow at the moment, and somewhat inclined towards giving Gwen a fresh start in S2.

I know that Season 1 had some issues that needed fixing, most notably being (a) there being waaaaaay too much screen time devoted to Gwen and (b) her being such a lying, cheating, useless waste of space.

But I feel that characters and shows deserve a second chance, and maybe, just maybe, if TPTB have fixed some of the problems with her, I might (just might) be able to tolerate her in S2. (of course this wonderful resolution of mine will probably only last until the first time she opens her mouth in ep1, but I think I'll give it a go)

What about anybody else? Is Gwen beyond redemption? Is there anything TPTB could do to make her more palatable to members of this comm?
(and yes, I am reminded of the following Star Trek TNG exhange -
Q "is there anything I can do to prove to you that I'm human?"
Worf "Die.")

Comments

[jo19844-twfic.livejournal.com]

i don't think she is beyond redemption, no.

But the checklist is as follows

1) No more being the torchwood bike
2) being compitant
3) Actualy having a defined role
4) Having a sense of humour
5) Quit the clinging
6) Decrease the mary-sueness in her character
7) not being over-written as a wondeful, yet fatally flawed, person
8) quit always being the 'conscience' or the 'heart'
9) More realism
10) Some fluidity in her character pls RTD.

Re: Poisoned Well

[jo19844-twfic.livejournal.com]

see what really did it for me was combat. It proved her selfishness.

Gwen

[jennelldhalrbj.livejournal.com]

Gwen had 13 episodes and to me that was enough. The only thing that could make me tolerate her was if she was dead. I could write a lovely episode myself where everyone mourns her and says nice things about her for about 5 minutes and then suddenly remember what a Scheiße she was.
Anyhow, everything I have read or heard about season two suggests that she is going to be just the same as before if not even more unbearable because the writers love her, and are basically unaware that a great many of the public don't.
Even John himself seemed unaware of this until a fan getting his autograph told him, when he asked if she wanted Jack to get together with Gwen, that everyone she knew wanted him and Ianto to be together.
It seems that this might be happening but was are still going to be bombarded with wonderful sensitive Gwen. I was amused when I read reviews by Paul Clark of each episode. He started off with episode one raving about how wonderful Gwen was. Then he mentioned her less and less and finally ended up by saying if he were Rhys he would just leave her. However, it was obvious that he was not able to come right out and criticize the character or how she was written.
I think this is because the whole thing was conceived by RTD and there is this unwritten law that no-one should ever find fault with him. John says he is a great writer and when I made one small criticism of his writing on another site I was banned.
So I am going to come right out with it. I think RTD is not a good writer. In fact, I think he's a fairly mediocre writer who has the occasional good idea. We are stuck with Gwen because of him and his rotten characterizations. He invented her character after all, even if other people write most of the episodes.
Unless the series is cancelled or Eve leaves we are going to be forever lumbered with Gwen and we just have to hope that she doesn't get too much air time in the future. I actually think that the people who like her character are unintentionally insulting women and I am surprised people don't see this.
I did some acting in Uni and I would have hated to play a part like Gwen. But that's just me. I wasn't getting paid was I?
Also to call her the heart of Torchwood is an insult. She is a lying useless bitch and should never have been employed in the first place. It doesn't say much for Torchwood's efficiency if she is second in Command either.
Having a rant because can't sleep as Benjamin John is doing the unborn equivalent of the rain dance. Hope he isn't born wearing boots!

Re: Gwen

[jennelldhalrbj.livejournal.com]

Feel I ought to add that I prefer TV programs about men with mostly male casts. I don't identify with women on TV much whatever role they are playing.
I like the male sex. I have a lot of female friends and that is enough for me. I don't have any need to see them emoting on TV. Actually I quite like Tosh but I wouldn't mind if there were no other females in the program.

[jo19844-twfic.livejournal.com]

ITA with what you said about RTD's writing. DW ep's for s3 and VOTD in parricular - in ep 1 of TW he wrote in 21 swearwords and then wonders why people say they swear too much; for thw people who switched off after ep1 that gave the wrong impression of the show.

he also created Ianto as a background character - and now hes become somebody who could so easily be a lead (mainly thanks to GDL's acting ability and care he took of the character and how he would react in any given situation he c;early has a clear vision in his mind) Gwen is a background character if i ever saw one.

[love-jackianto.livejournal.com]

Count me as another person who agrees about RTD's writing, he has a few good ideas but other then that...

I also agree with everything you said about Ianto. If the role had been given to a lesser actor they most likely would have killed him off like they originally planned, or so I have heard.

Re: Gwen

[nightporters.livejournal.com]

You are so right about RTD's writing!

[love-jackianto.livejournal.com]

I have been thinking about this and there really is not anything the writers can do at this point to make me like Gwen. I think it is because the writers *tell* us what a wonderful, caring person she is, but then they have her do really horrible, insensitive and down right stupid things (the 'who was the last person you snogged' game and retconing Rhys are just two of the *many* examples). At least they could have redeemed her some what by having Rhys stay dead, but no.

However, I might be able to tolerate her if, and only if, they give her *much* less screen time (her not being in entire episodes is about right).

[nightporters.livejournal.com]

Less screen time (yeah right)

[amythest-n-ice.livejournal.com]

There would have to be signs of a major character overhaul in the first couple of episodes for her to get another chance from me.