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antigwenallies Aug. 13th, 2009 03:59 pm)
wanda1969.livejournal.com posting in antigwenallies Aug. 13th, 2009 03:59 pm)I'd just like to point out that this is the FIRST time I have EVER made a post on lj (and, did that tax my computer skills!? YES! )- thank (or don't thank!) swine 'flu on that issue!
In the past couple of days (being on sick leave) I have been reading AGA and noticed a post about RTD's psychology- mother complexes and so on; carrying on from this I'd just like to ask if anybody else had noted RTD' s obsession with "companions" in knee/thigh length boots? I was dismayed to find that in Children of Earth, Torchwood seemed to have been taken over by women. Don't get me wrong, I'm female, but when watching Dr Who/TW, my partner and myself have noticed that RTD/BBC seem to be obsessed with "strong women in boots and tight trousers"- we put this down to an Emma Peel/Cathy Gale complex. Think about it- Agt Johnson, Lady Christina De Souza, Martha, Gwen (although MUCH, MUCH less appealing than the aforementioned women) etc- in our household, we judge the longevity of TW/DW characters by whether they will fit into the tight trousers and boots! This, in my mind, is RTD trying to recreate some kind of female Avengers/Gwen's Angels series. Not what I signed up for! Bet you five quid that Lois Habiba would fit into said outfit!
My second comment is that, as a UK resident, I am used to the BBC repeating previous series a week or two beforehand when a new series comes out- bizarrely this did not happen. In fact, I think that TW2 hasn't been repeated on BBC since more or less when it came out in 2008. Another theory in my household is that this was because the BBC wanted a clean slate- they didn't want those "new" BBC1 viewers to know too much about the past history of the characters- ie they wanted Gwen to be appealling (eg not a woman who would have affairs with colleagues( & pine after Jack)- they also wanted her to look competent (not the kind of woman who could not operate a GPS device), and Ianto to be whiningly clingy so they could kill him off etc. Many apologies if I was supposed to put this behind a cut, but actually posting was quite a challenge to me- I think I need to lie down! I was just wondering what other readers felt???? Thanks!
In the past couple of days (being on sick leave) I have been reading AGA and noticed a post about RTD's psychology- mother complexes and so on; carrying on from this I'd just like to ask if anybody else had noted RTD' s obsession with "companions" in knee/thigh length boots? I was dismayed to find that in Children of Earth, Torchwood seemed to have been taken over by women. Don't get me wrong, I'm female, but when watching Dr Who/TW, my partner and myself have noticed that RTD/BBC seem to be obsessed with "strong women in boots and tight trousers"- we put this down to an Emma Peel/Cathy Gale complex. Think about it- Agt Johnson, Lady Christina De Souza, Martha, Gwen (although MUCH, MUCH less appealing than the aforementioned women) etc- in our household, we judge the longevity of TW/DW characters by whether they will fit into the tight trousers and boots! This, in my mind, is RTD trying to recreate some kind of female Avengers/Gwen's Angels series. Not what I signed up for! Bet you five quid that Lois Habiba would fit into said outfit!
My second comment is that, as a UK resident, I am used to the BBC repeating previous series a week or two beforehand when a new series comes out- bizarrely this did not happen. In fact, I think that TW2 hasn't been repeated on BBC since more or less when it came out in 2008. Another theory in my household is that this was because the BBC wanted a clean slate- they didn't want those "new" BBC1 viewers to know too much about the past history of the characters- ie they wanted Gwen to be appealling (eg not a woman who would have affairs with colleagues( & pine after Jack)- they also wanted her to look competent (not the kind of woman who could not operate a GPS device), and Ianto to be whiningly clingy so they could kill him off etc. Many apologies if I was supposed to put this behind a cut, but actually posting was quite a challenge to me- I think I need to lie down! I was just wondering what other readers felt???? Thanks!
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Gwen's Angels ~~~ cringe. NOOOOOOOOOOO. What have we ever done to deserve that.
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Now I come to think about it, it does seem all the females wear some type of leather trousers, which some of them look good in them but not many of them (ie. Gwen) and if you lookat it that way, they all seem to try and be sexy and to compete with each other (excpet Donna because she has enough clout in the show business to say NO) Mayeb RTD is hoping to make the show more about the woman not the men as most shows do lead with a top male character.
I've noticed that as well, I've resorted to watching the TV channel "Watch" to view previous episodes (I do have the box set but alas its buried under all my uni things in the wardrobe) It was already hinted before CoE came out that BBC1 wanted new viewers to watch it and not have to get the previous series to understand what was going on. As its been going up the channels its become more safer in it's topics and toned down the sexuaility of the overall program. Bring it back on BBC3 is all I can say!
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Protect us all from "Once upon a time there were 3 young Cardiff girls....." (I can't remeber the exact speil!). It really annoys me that the only "un-self centered" 'companion' (in both DW and TW) in recent years appears to have been Donna- mind you my partner and I think she was dipensed with because she wouldn't fit in Gwen's leather/black trousers.
I am old (old enough to remember Jon Pertwee, sadly) and was astounded by how Gwen was presented in Children of Earth- competent, not totally self centered, faithful and so on.
I was watching another show!
And then i recalled i was EXPECTING the pre series 3 repeats to remind me of the characters (not that i needed it- Gwen had seared herself, unpleasantly, into my mind), and I started to think that this was the BBC trying to forget series 1 and 2, as if they were pretending that those 2 series had never existed.....
I am starting to live in fear that they WILL make another series- I have visions of sillhouettes of Gwen, Lois and Agt Johnson, in leather trousers in the titles.....
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As for a program about three women wearing leather pants----ugh--not for me anyhow---especially if one of them is Gwen---
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http://www.rankopedia.com/CandidatePix/33130.gif
http://blended.fr/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/emmapeel.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_ymkunE44jBA/SQUxe57EH_I/AAAAAAAAAPs/wzdYCU-Pf0I/s400/Cathy+Gale.jpg
There's also Tara King who drove (if I rememeber correctly, a Lotus)- she replaced Emma Peel (Diana Rigg)- see I don't hate women: just the badly charaterized Gwen.
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I have always appreciated the Avengers ideal for women as one of my favorite characters is Buffy the Vampire Slayer, a girly chick that kicks ass. So having companions that can do is plus to me. I just don't feel Gwen falls into this category, they have tried to squeeze her there in CoE, but Gwen is not a quick witted strong character to be a Avengers/Buffy chick, she is more like the Bond girl, seems smart but in the end has to be rescued and then gets all swarmy to her hero to get laid.
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As for the Gwen show, (God forbid), I hope no one watches. I mean, Eve Myles is pretty, but RTD loved her for her soap-opera work. Not for her acting skills, but her soap-acting skills.
(I think I'm tired enough that I'm rambling, hopefully this made sense)
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Family friendly.
Of course, my Husbands best friend is gay and they met on their first day at Schule, so all our kids are growing up with the idea that being gay is not strange or disgusting but just part of life.
Adding elements like Jack objecting to being called a couple were, to me, rather unpleasant.
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Re: Family friendly.
Here in the UK, there is more homosexuality on Eastenders at 7.30 in the evening.
Yes, there were quite a few elements I found unpleasant: Clem, although" he was still mentally stuck in 1965.
In retrospect, I also note that they had reduced Ianto's lines to either prattling about "being a couple" or simply reading out Lois' shorthand. Perhaps I should have seen his demise coming a lot more quickly than I did!
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Despite never posting here previously, I agree with everyone's views on the characterization/acting etc of Gwen's character!
As for the BBC ensuring that the show was family friendly- its not their usual MO! I too have read this, but never thought the show wasn't family friendly in the first place(Perhaps I have loose morals)!!
I demand my license fee back immediately!
And, yes, if they were going to have a female lead perhaps the writers should have watched more episodes of Buffy and definately the Avengers- at least good old Emma Peel and Cathy had martial arts skills!
And in my opinion, all they did was shoehorn the ENTIRE remaining Torchwood team into Children of Earth anyway. I am a bit behind everyone else on the whole series 3 controversy/debate as I was on holiday (with very little TV access) when the last 2 episodes of CoE were aired.
Fear not about rambling- I am too. I blame it on the 'flu medication.
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Gods, why didn't they spend money on a brand new series if all they did was clean up TW in CoE instead? Oh wait, those fans who's been watching S1 & S2 would add to the viewing figures, never mind they then pissed half of them off, they got new viewers.
If I only wanted kick ass women, I'll go back to my first love or what I grew up with, Wuxia, where there are at least one woman who can kick ass.
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My view is that they should have left TW well alone and just created a DIFFERENT political/sci-fi/drama. I am convinced that they have enough license payers' money to have another series running.
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Gwen carrying the show
It was only the other characters that kept me watching TW from the first time the BBC showed it.
Eve Myles is going to be in a new BBC series at the end of August- I may well tune in to see her acting "range"....if I can bear to!
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Re: Gwen carrying the show
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Shows can have a kick ass female lead as well as awesome male lead at the same time, they can also have a whole team of kick ass women, they just need to write it so she's not hurricane Gwen. Everyone backs down or do whatever she says, regardless of anything. That's what ruined the male/female dynamic between her and Jack. She's confrontational without the tact, and plows right on without regards to others or even slows down to ask for advice, it's called bad leadership.
It's just painful to watch because the writers themselves seems to have no idea how an organization is run and it shows. I wouldn't mind half the time because as you mentioned, S1 and S2 were FUN, they didn't took themselves seriously, or at least I hope they didn't. So lots of things got swept under the rug and we just rolls our eyes when Gwen says she's been running TW in between S1 and S2.
I don't think Gwen is going to leave, ever, if TW can go on for another three season, she'll still be there with an ever dying cast revolving around her.
Oh my, sorry, I've gotten ranty.
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Re: Gwen carrying the show
As you probably have noticed I don't mind kick arse women- they just have to have SKILLS/INTELLIGENCE of some form. I don't even mind the tight pants. As you have seen I am STILL in awe of the Avengers "girls" all these years on. And you didn't get Emma Peel hitting on Steed on her wedding day (not that i remember her having a wedding day...?). In the Radio Times (BBC TV listings magazine for non UK readers)last week, the review of the repeat of Day 4 CoE was so pleased that "...8 roles were for strong women..." (I may have slightly misquoted this), that perhaps this is where my worries about future series have come from!! Incidentally, the review of tonight's episode says that CoE was "the best thing that ever could have happened to TW- so they are surely mightily pleased with themselves.
It's just that I obviously didn't read the small print on RTD's tin (the Rusty Tin?)- "warning: you may think that this show is a bit of fun about a Team of alien hunters in Cardiff, but consume enough and you will find out it's actually about the work and family life of the highly irritating Gwen Williams (nee Cooper)". I'll have to get my specs out next time.
And, oh yes, I really hope the 1st 2 series were meant to be fun....in our house they were known as "Campwood" (no offence to people who didn't see the show as camp is meant here! And it certainly isn't an insult).
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Re: Gwen carrying the show
You know, I'll be really surprised if TW was as well received by a vast majority as they claim and that we're just a small loud part. It looks like they're doing a "if we tell people enough times, it must be true" kinda deal to me. Sure, I like some parts of it, but as a whole, CoE was a huge disappointment, not because they killed Ianto, but because it have no rewatch value. I'll be really interested in the figures for the re-run.
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Re: Gwen carrying the show
Also, just before 9pm, when I read out the TV choices (which included CoE) to Mr Wanda1969, he replied "I never want to watch that again!" with more vehemence than I can remember ever hear him use about a TV show. It seems that he was pretty miffed that after sitting through hours of flabby fillers, all we got were child addicted aliens (preceded by Jack's master plan- shout at the 456 and confront them with a man in a snazzy waistcoat). So, the re-run figures would be fun to see.
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I'm afraid I have no idea where BBC3 publish their viewing figures, though....
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